The upcoming results of Canada's election make me go #$@!

[RoastedTwinkies]

As you guys all probably know, Canada had it's election today. Even now, the results are still coming in, but it looks like Canada will have another Liberal government, but a minority Liberal government this time at least (thank god), but it's something that I'm still pissed about. Here is why.

There are a number of things that I'm particularily angry about. Canada has had over ten years of Liberal rule and since the end of World War II, our government has done nothing but cut back on our military and go into deficit spending (though the deficit spending has finally ended now and payments are being made against the debt). Canada has always depended on the US military umberella. When we sent out our troops to Afghanistan, they were sent out in army green uniforms because the government simply couldn't provide desert uniforms and they had to use sand an paint on their uniforms to blend into the background. That's just one example of how our military is treated and it's truly a national disgrace. I believe the military is important because we need it to protect our soverignty. Apparently the US and another country (I can't remember which one) are disputing about land that's within Canadian territory and it's quite possible that we could lose up to 40% of our country whether the people like it or not. How are we supposed to defend it if we don't have an adequate military to do so? I think people are crazy to want to join the Canadian military (no offence to anyone who does). And I'm clearly not the only one who thinks so. Statistics show that more people are leaving the military than joining. Our military needs to be treated well, because of all the sacrifices that they have made for us.

Like I talked about in the homosexuality discussion, I'm also not happy with the direction our government has taken marriage, because of the reasons I had discussed before... ie militple or incestual marriages. I'm not going to spend any more time on that issue since it belongs in the homosexuality topic.

On top of that, all we ever heard from the Liberal Government, is nothing but scandal after scandal after scandal. Just in case if you guys haven't heard about the lastest one... recently, just before the election, several billion taxpayer's dollars (I forget just how many, but it was a lot) disappeared into thin air. Paul Martin claims to know anything about it, but it's impossible because he used to be finance minister! How the hell could he not know?! I suspect that the money went into the pockets of Liberal supporters and spent on the Liberal campain for this election. However, there's no proof to show that, and a lot of people are especially pissed about that too.

Because of all this, I was hoping the new Conservatives would win. The conservatives are just a little extreme about building up the forces. I also think it was a huge mistake for someone in the party to stand up and say that Paul Martin supported child pornography. It was an even bigger mistake when Stephen Harper turned around defending it. He should have said that he doesn't agree with that and that he would punish whoever it was who suggested that. I think that mistake really cost the Conservatives a lot of votes. However, despite all that, I think they were headed in the right direction.

However, since I can't change the upcoming results, now that I think of it, a Liberal minority government isn't so bad because they have to get the support of every party in the house, otherwise the government will fall. It's much better than a majority government where the party can do whatever it wants regardless of the objections of the other parties. That's basically a dictatorship. If you go through Canadian history, you'll find that minority governments have worked best for the country.

Lastly, discuss your opinions on this. Discussion on the Canadian election is preferred, but American discussion is allowed too. What are your thoughts and opinions?

Also, since politics can be a major hot potato, please refrain from flaming and respect everyone's opinions. (sorry, I don't want to sound like a mod when I'm not- I just don't want to see this topic get locked because things got too heated)

[peachvampiress]

Yes I've been watching it to. Did you notice that the Liberals stopped at 137 and the Conservatives kept climbing? I thought they'd win T_T. And RoastedTwinkies isn't exagerating about them losing BILLIONS of dollars, it's true, and it happened in a span of about 6 months (I think) :coughsponsorshipscandalcouch:

And about Harper's comments to Martin about the whole pornography thing, wasn't it refering to Martin not being fully supportive of a law that would help prevent child porn? I never read the whole thing, but it's something like that (if it is, then I support the comment, even if it was extreme).

I hate Paul Martin. The only good thing about him is he isn't French (and no that isn't a racist comment, if you lived on the West of Canada you'd understand).

RoastedTwinkies, I don't want to sound racist, but I don't know how to ask this Politically Correctly, but why do East Indians vote for the NDP? I don't really know what they are, but I noticed that they vote for them.

[RoastedTwinkies]

Yes I've been watching it to. Did you notice that the Liberals stopped at 137 and the Conservatives kept climbing? I thought they'd win T_T. And RoastedTwinkies isn't exagerating about them losing BILLIONS of dollars, it's true, and it happened in a span of about 6 months (I think) :coughsponsorshipscandalcouch:

And about Harper's comments to Martin about the whole pornography thing, wasn't it refering to Martin not being fully supportive of a law that would help prevent child porn? I never read the whole thing, but it's something like that (if it is, then I support the comment, even if it was extreme).

I hate Paul Martin. The only good thing about him is he isn't French (and no that isn't a racist comment, if you lived on the West of Canada you'd understand).

RoastedTwinkies, I don't want to sound racist, but I don't know how to ask this Politically Correctly, but why do East Indians vote for the NDP? I don't really know what they are, but I noticed that they vote for them.

Don't worry about that. I'm pretty politically incorrect myself, and there are some things that I believe that I would not dare say on this board or anywhere else. I think people (not just the indians) are voting for the NDP because they're pissed at the Liberals, but yet, they think the new Conservative party is the boogyman, so they vote NDP.

I also hate Paul Martin. I think he's a worm. Though I don't think he's nearly as bad as Cretien was.

And I did notice the stats on the news today too. I was really hoping the Conservatives would win X_X

[peachvampiress]

Yeah, but here in my town especially it was only East Indians who had the NDP signs on their yards. Maybe you're right, I don't know, and I'd feel weird going door to door asking why

About Canada's relations with America, everyone was bitching about how Harper was all wanting to team up with America in the war with Iraq, and every one was pissing and moaning saying how he's unpatriotic. Now, I'm pretty patriotic, but Harper's decision is a good one. People of Canada, WE NEED THE USA!! Like you said, Twink, our army sucks. If we're attacked, we're screwed royally, we need the USA as our allies, and a lot of people fail to notice that, saying how will stop being Canada and start being more American. WTF?? Like there's that much of a difference (what, are we going to stop eating moose and start drinking flavourless American beer?)

Chretein did a lot of damage when he told America we wouldn't support them in the war. FOR F$^CK SAKES CHRETIEN!! YOU JUST HAVE TO GIVE SUPPORT, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO JACK ALL! ... ... ...yeah, you can tell who I hate ^_^;

Blarg, more people join in so it doesn't look like RT and I are making this into a chat room ~_^

[Sailorasteroid]

However, since I can't change the upcoming results, now that I think of it, a Liberal minority government isn't so bad because they have to get the support of every party in the house, otherwise the government will fall. It's much better than a majority government where the party can do whatever it wants regardless of the objections of the other parties. That's basically a dictatorship. If you go through Canadian history, you'll find that minority governments have worked best for the country.

I've heard the theory that the Liberals are going to have to swing even more to the left to get the support of the New Dems, which if they have will give them the majority vote. So the best we can hope for is that all the parties gridlock and nothing gets done. I agree with Thomas Paine, who said, "The government is best which governs least."

I also don't like what it might say for the November US election, where I'm hoping to see the Democrats lose soundly so that President Bush can further the War on Terrorism unencumbered. I'm not worried about Bush himself, who will almost certainly keep office if only on the sheer unelectablility of anyone else, but about the Congress where the Republicans have made steady gains. If the leftist sentiment is so strong in Canada that the Liberals can survive a scandal, it doesn't bode well for conservatism in the US. On the other hand, the US is a much more institutionally conservative country, and a lot of Democrat incumbent senators are up for reelection, so it might not mean anything

[Lady of the Light]

I, like basically everyone who has replied to this topic, hate Paul Martin. Even though I do live in Ontario and might look at things differently, I'm still sick of the ten year Liberal rule. Especially with the scandals. 100 million went to sponsering a 'Canadian image' in Quebec, 2 billion is wasted on the gun registery...No wonder our freaking health care system is in shambles. If I can't trust a government in managing my(Or rather, my parent's) money, why should I elect them?

But at least one bright thing to this is that the Liberals only have a minority at the moment, so they have to work harder at doing things to please, so they don't get kicked out. The Conservatives and the Bloc are going to make their lives a lot harder.

Might I also add that I think the entire thing where the vote is decided in Ontario is demented, even though I live here. I think it's like 108 seats now or something, and just for one province, that's just not right. Everything is basically decided in one place, and if you ask me, that doesn't do much for the rest of the country. What about P.E.I, huh? It has like, what, six seats? I'm sure that's going to get them represented properly. And all of the Territories have three seats combined! It's just not right...

[peachvampiress]

Hit the nail right on the head LadyOL. Canada is the perfect example of a country ruled by the minority. The Maratimes, Praries, and B.C. always get screwed over. And I like how the goverenment has down little to help B.C. with it's Forest Fires. Alberta and Saskachewan are the ones helpin us fight them. The Prime Minister seems to be forgetting that B.C.'s biggest natural resource is its forests. If we lose them, we're screwed.

O/T but no one's said it here yet. VANCOUVER GOT THE 2010 WINTER OLYMPICS!! W00T W00T!! WE KICK @R$E.

(Ya, I'm slow, I didn't here about it 'til now ^_^; )

[RoastedTwinkies]

No kidding. The government doesn't give a rat's ass about what happens in Western Canada because they get most of their votes in Ontario and Quebec. It boggles my mind that people still voted for the Liberals even after all this crap that happened.

[shansen]

I actually got to vote in the election - first time for a national election. It's really not very exciting. Unfold a piece of paper, and put a big 'X' beside the person you want to vote for.

Anyway, I was pulling for the new Conservatives, but I figured it would be a Liberal win. It was just a matter of how close they'd be to a majority.

To be honest, I don't like Stephen Harper. I just hate Martin and Layton more ... for Harper, it's more of a dislike.

The only good thing is that it's a minority. Maybe that will help things out ... or maybe nothing will get accomplished. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

[Lady of the Light]

No kidding. The government doesn't give a rat's ass about what happens in Western Canada because they get most of their votes in Ontario and Quebec. It boggles my mind that people still voted for the Liberals even after all this crap that happened.

The reason why most people voted Liberal in Ontario is because even though most of them are sick of the Liberal's they can't 'trust' the other parties because A) Stephen Harper doesn't have enough 'experience' to run the country,(Which is what my Grandmother said. "Well, Martin has more experience..." Me: "In what, lying?") and B)The NDP will put us in the poorhouse and C)There's no point in voting Green.
Well, the last one was sorta true, since it was basically a protest vote for Green (Which didn't stop my relatives from doing so) and the middle one might be true, but the first one isn't. I mean, come on, I trust Harper to run the country more than I do Layton...Layton would put us in the bloody poorhouse with his policies...And Martin already showed us that he's brilliant at managing money, a hundred million went missing when he was Finance Minister...He says he didn't know ANYTHING about it, so oh yeah, that should make us feel better, our Finance Minister doesn't know what's going on with our money...If he can't do his job as Minister of Finance properly, what makes us think that he can do his job as Prime Minister?

[RoastedTwinkies]

*Edited for space* And Martin already showed us that he's brilliant at managing money, a hundred million went missing when he was Finance Minister...He says he didn't know ANYTHING about it, so oh yeah, that should make us feel better, our Finance Minister doesn't know what's going on with our money...If he can't do his job as Minister of Finance properly, what makes us think that he can do his job as Prime Minister?

Exactly. That's why I don't trust Paul Martin. Not one bit. But, now we're stuck with him for the next four years, unless he does something stupid (which is a given) and one or all the other parties pull out their support. >_<

[SailorJupiter]

I was hoping the NDP would win >_< I just don't understand why people vote for Paul Martin and the liberals. They are just terrible at everything they do.

[RoastedTwinkies]

I was hoping the NDP would win >_< I just don't understand why people vote for Paul Martin and the liberals. They are just terrible at everything they do.

But at least with a minority government, they're limited to how much crap they can pull. They can't go overboard like they can as a majority government, otherwise one or all the other parties will yank their support and the government will fall. The Liberal government is putty in their hands. I'm happy about that, at least.

[Anthy]

I was hoping the NDP would win >_< I just don't understand why people vote for Paul Martin and the liberals. They are just terrible at everything they do.

Please don't make your entire post bold. Bold is for emphasis.

...President Bush can further the War on Terrorism unencumbered.

Unencumbered, except for everyone but his conservatives against the War on "Terrorism."

If the leftist sentiment is so strong in Canada that the Liberals can survive a scandal, it doesn't bode well for conservatism in the US.

Even though Canada and the US are close together, it doesn't mean the elections will affect each other. I'm curious as to your reasons for how exactly leftist statement would have any impact anything in the US... however, it's irrelevant to the topic, so I won't ask.

No further discussion on the US.

[RoastedTwinkies]

Yay! Paul Martin fucked up so we got another election! *throws confetti*

It looks like the Conservatives are going to win this time. And this time, I can legally vote. You can be sure that my vote is going to the Conservatives.

After the english debate on Monday, I've come to hate Martin so much more. The hidden Liberal agenda has been revealed. First they came out with the gun registry some years back, and people were saying that it's the prelude to gun seisure. Cretien denied it at the time. But Paul Martin said on Monday night that he wants to ban handguns! What's next? Shotguns? Archery? If the police and the military are the only ones with weapons, the people of Canada have no way of defending themselves.

It's scary and people may think that I'm being ridiculious. This is what Hitler and Stalin did before their dictatorships took over Germany and Russia/Soviet Union. If you disarm the population, you've got them by the throat. If people disagreed with them, they disappeared in the middle of the night and were never seen or heard from again. Political opponets also had the same fate. Eventually all opposing parties became illegal. Nobody thought something like that would happen in a place as modern as Germany, but it did. We all know what happened in World War II. And what makes it scarier is knowing that Adolf Hitler was democratically elected.

The other thing that pissed me off was that Martin said he wanted to do away with the "Not Withstanding Clause" which the government uses to overturn ridiculious court decisions. This is obviously because he wanted to please the gay community and gain more votes. But the danger with this is that the power is taken away from the politicians that we elected and puts it in the power of the judges that were appointed by the prime minister and not elected by anyone. This is wrong. The power needs to stay with the government, not with the courts. The courts are there to interpret and apply our laws, not create them. The Supreme Court of Canada is NOT going to tell me how I'm going to live my life.

[peachvampiress]

No, Don't vote for the Conservatives, THEY HAVE A HIDDEN AGENDA!!!!!!11111111 [/sarcasm]

Seriously though, RoastedTwinkies you must be my Alberta equivelent *glomps*

Ah yes, the gun registry. Because of course criminals are going to just up and register there no doubt illigally purchased handguns. And I just love how after the gun registry proved to be a complete and total failure, costing us billions of dollars, Cretien wanted to try it again >_<.

The other thing that pissed me off was that Martin said he wanted to do away with the "Not Withstanding Clause" which the government uses to overturn ridiculious court decisions.

Paul Martin: "If you elect me as your leader, I promise to make sure that anyone who opposes my stupid ideas will be unable to do anything about and be forced to submit to my will, whether or not it's what the Canadian people want."

The way Canada's government is heading seriously scares the Hell out me. I really hope the Conservatives win and we can start to get some changes to the way things are handled.

[RoastedTwinkies]

Seriously though, RoastedTwinkies you must be my Alberta equivelent *glomps*

*Glomps back*

Ah yes, the gun registry. Because of course criminals are going to just up and register there no doubt illigally purchased handguns. And I just love how after the gun registry proved to be a complete and total failure, costing us billions of dollars, Cretien wanted to try it again >_<.

It's total bullshit. They obviously came out with the registry to find out who owns what gun so they can seize them later >_>

The Liberals refuse to address the problem at its root, the criminal. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. Don't punish the legal guns owners who didn't commit the crime. Target the criminal!

But oooooooh no, I Paul Martin, am worried that someone will break into your house and steal your guns and kill someone! So we need to remove the guns from your house to make the community safer! /sarcasm

The way Canada's government is heading seriously scares the Hell out me. I really hope the Conservatives win and we can start to get some changes to the way things are handled.

This is why I wouldn't be opposed to becoming the 51st state of America. (how likely is that to happen? Like not >_>) if the Conservatives don't win. If that doesn't happen, then hell, I'll move just about anywhere in the US.

I also think the Liberal attack ads are wrong. They compare Harper to Bush and that's a huge insult. A few years back, someone from the Liberal party called Bush a moron. Then they wonder why the US bans Canadian beef. The Liberals aren't helping US/Canada relations at all by sniping at Bush/America at every opportunity.

Harper wanted to expand the military. The Liberals glorified this in an attack ad by comparing it to dictatorships in third world countries. That's never ever happened under Conservative rule in any period in Canada! The only time we've had the military in our cities is during aid in disasters, such as the Flood of 1997 in Winnipeg, Manitoba!

[peachvampiress]

OMFG XD

There's a site with a bunch of ads parodying the Liberal Party's attack ads on Steven Harper.

Everyone go here. Go here even if you aren't Canadian and have no clue about what's going on in Canada because these are just hilarious. My favorite so far is the National Unity one.

And yes, for those who haven't seen the real ads, they look just like this and are just as ridiuclous. And the ads do all end with the phrase "We're not making this up. We're not allowed to".

[RoastedTwinkies]

OMFG XD

There's a site with a bunch of ads parodying the Liberal Party's attack ads on Steven Harper.

Everyone go here. Go here even if you aren't Canadian and have no clue about what's going on in Canada because these are just hilarious. My favorite so far is the National Unity one.

And yes, for those who haven't seen the real ads, they look just like this and are just as ridiuclous. And the ads do all end with the phrase "We're not making this up. We're not allowed to".

HAHAHAHAHA That's pure gold!

It looks like we've got a minority Conservative government this time. I'm a little disappointed, but at least it's not another Liberal government. So this means we can expect another election in another year and a half to two years. Majority governments are better on the cost factor alone. It costs $300 million to run an election and that works out to $1.75 per vote. That money can be better spent on other things besides elections.

[peachvampiress]

W00T! No more Liberal government, although I am a bit shocked at how many votes they did get. Seriously, who the hell is still voting for the Paul Martin? What does the guy have to do before more peope realise that he's pure evil? Bite the head off a puppy live on CBC?