Matrix Revolutions (spoilers!)

[shansen]

Definite spoilers await ... if you haven't seen the movie + don't want to be spoiled, stop reading this now!

Rather than making an entire post in spoiler code, I'd like to make this entire topic spoiler-related ... you have all been warned.



OK ... first of all, I thought this movie was absolutely awful. I didn't think it could get any worse than Reloaded, but it did. Big time.

The whole movie seems to center around Zion and defending it from the Sentinels, when in fact the biggest threat (which is hardly even mentioned) is Agent Smith, who is in danger of taking over both the Matrix and the real world.

Here are my main complaints:

- The entire Zion battle sequence. Good CG, but excruciatingly repetitive. Here comes a digger ... it broke through. Now millions of sentinels will come out, all fly in a single, straight, unbroken line, waiting to be shot out of the sky. We spend at least 45 minutes (if not closer to an hour) watching this battle go on, and on, and on. My brother-in-law summed it up best ... it's pretty sad when you start rooting for the machines to take out the last good guy so that the plot will advance. Speaking of the plot, Neo is nowhere to be seen in this entire battle! He's off to the machine city. There are no cuts to him or anything ... he just suddenly arrives with Trinity outside the city.

- Just before Neo and Trinity leave, they have a battle with ... that guy who betrayed them (I can't remember his name). Anyway, he manages to cut power, but then an EM pulse hits the insides of the ship, causing them to flash on and off repeatedly. This lasted so long, I couldn't even watch ... as a result, I had to ask my brother-in-law what happened to Neo's eyes. The scene lasted several minutes, and was really bad.

- I really didn't like the final battle between Neo and Agent Smith. First of all, Smith says that he knows the outcome, so his copies will just stand and watch. How about being on the safe side and asking a few (million) of them to join in? Seeing how much difficulty Neo had with one, I doubt he would have fared well.

Next was the special effects. What was cool at first (the bubble being formed by the force of their collisions) became repetitive as it was repeated several times over.

Thirdly, Agent Smith pile drives Neo from way up in the air on the ground. Neo is down and out, but still alive. Does Smith move in for the kill? Of course not ... he talks about how it's pointless for humans to struggle and try to survive. He could smash a rock on Neo's head, or punch him in the head, or do something, but instead he just talks.

He then gets Neo down again, but instead of killing him recites some line the Oracle said. Neo fights back, but gets changed into Agent Smith. All of a sudden, for no apparent reason, the machine that linked him to the Matrix suddenly adds a bunch of connectors and gives Neo a huge jolt that suddenly causes all of the Smiths to burst light from their bodies and disintegrate ... or something.

- There was very little closure in the ending. The war is over, and the humans that want to be released will be released ... at least for the time being. I doubt it will last very long. And what about Neo? Why did the machine take him? Where did he go? He was shining really brightly, but is he dead?

I hope that these unanswered questions are not preludes to another sequel. If there is, I definitely will not waste my time going to a theatre to see it.

Basically, this movie was hugely disappointing. Between pointless repetitive action, other pointless non-action oriented scenes, seizure-inducing lights, and millions and millions of incredibly stupid bad guys (good thing they didn't try attacking from more than one side at once ... they might have actually done well), the movie was really bad.

[Tiff]

o_O;
I loved it. So did Derek (boyfriend), who takes these movies really seriously.
I didn't care for a lot of what went on in Reloaded (especially the hour long rave/sex scene), but Revolutions really surpassed it, IMO. It wrapped everything up nicely. My boyfrined put it this way: "The Matrix was like birth...The Matrix: Reloaded was like life...and The Matrix: Revolutions was like death. Neo experiences these things throughout each movie".

There was very little closure in the ending. The war is over, and the humans that want to be released will be released ... at least for the time being. I doubt it will last very long. And what about Neo? Why did the machine take him? Where did he go? He was shining really brightly, but is he dead?

o_O; i thought it had a lot of closure. We (Derek and I) pretty much say that Neo died. I didn't gather that the machines "took him"...I gathered that he just died there, and stayed there. Hell, where else would his and Trinity's bodies go? Back to Zion? He served his purpose. Everyone had a purpose, just as Trinity said...she served hers, and could go no further. Neo served his, and died as well.

He then gets Neo down again, but instead of killing him recites some line the Oracle said. Neo fights back, but gets changed into Agent Smith. All of a sudden, for no apparent reason, the machine that linked him to the Matrix suddenly adds a bunch of connectors and gives Neo a huge jolt that suddenly causes all of the Smiths to burst light from their bodies and disintegrate ... or something.

It wasn't "for no reason". The machines helped him defeat Smith, becuase they figured out that without him, Smith couldn't be destroyed. But all of that power that the machines gave him, killed him (combined with the fact that Smith took over Neo). Smith was a program. He was deleted, destroyed, whatever you want to call it. He didn't just "disentegrate, or something".

To me, there were no pointless drawn-out scenes. Everything had a point, and it pretty much jumped and kept you right with it. I loved the fight scenes, especially between Smith and Neo. I thought it was extremely awesome. And the emotion of the movie was breathtaking..I sobbed my eyes out when Trinity died, and she's one of the characters that gets on my nerves the most. But the sheer emotion of it was overwhelming.

I don't see the problems you see, but oh well. We all have our opinions.[/quote]

[Em]

Note sorry in advance with any spelling errors

Revolutions was better then Reloade no doubt and almost on par with the Matrix.

What happend in in the end with Neo ebcomeing a Smith was shokcing to me I wasn't expecting that at all this guy behind me went WTF?

The oracl thing got me going I didn't get most of it with her like why did Smith Oracl fight Neo instead of Smith Smith? ( hopefuly someone understood that)

I don't think Neo died personaly I think he became one wiht teh meachines and is now part of the matrix ( or it seemed as it was a bible thing and he went somewere else to a better palce)

Must amit to three thing I had to bite my lip not to go Ka- ma-ka- ma- ha with that Smith/ Neo battle
And when he ( Smith) was going to "Why Mr Anderson why why why don you fight?" ect not to go "Why Mr rrevees was it for the money you did these moives?" ect and Revves to go "No it was for the house they gave me"
I was more inmpreesed my Return of thr King tralier for Lord of the Ring's

[Akarui Kibuno]

Bwah, the spoiler addict got to this topic, aha

I haven't seen the movie yet. Waiting for tomorrow. But in original version with subtitles (won a battle with my boyfriend who desperately wanted to watch it in French ) and it was interesting to read all this.

Thanks, guys

[Obsessive Touga Fan]

I agree with Tiff for the most part (except that I really loved Reloaded too). I think the movie was great all-round and gave enough closure but not too much. I'm not without my complaints, but still, the more debate I read about it online, the more I like it - and that's saying something considering how many people online seem to hate it ^^;

The oracl thing got me going I didn't get most of it with her like why did Smith Oracl fight Neo instead of Smith Smith? ( hopefuly someone understood that)

All of the Smiths are Smith... none of them are more Smith than any other Smith, there isn't one "Smith Smith". The Oracle Smith becomes the most powerful/significant one because it can do something the others can't, and hence that one becomes the one that is focused on, the one that fights Neo.

[Em]

All of the Smiths are Smith... none of them are more Smith than any other Smith, there isn't one "Smith Smith". The Oracle Smith becomes the most powerful/significant one because it can do something the others can't, and hence that one becomes the one that is focused on, the one that fights Neo.

Now you say that I get it I tought as I saaid before there was a Smith Smith and the Oracl Smith was chosen to fight

[yoshmaster5]

Me:

I knew this about Revolutions.

Better than: Reloaded- *why must they SHOW Neo & Trinity doing it? and for 20 minutes? 20 minutes of wasted footage. *shudder**

Not as good as Original.

[Tiff]

Me:

I knew this about Revolutions.

Better than: Reloaded- *why must they SHOW Neo & Trinity doing it? and for 20 minutes? 20 minutes of wasted footage. *shudder**

Not as good as Original.

Exactly my thoughts.

[Lady J]

I just got back from seeing it and I thought it was great. I would post more, but I'm so tired.

[shansen]

Better than: Reloaded- *why must they SHOW Neo & Trinity doing it? and for 20 minutes? 20 minutes of wasted footage. *shudder**

Not as good as Original.

I agree with the fact that the Neo/Trinity thing in Reloaded was awful ... I was watching this in a theatre, and actually stopped watching it and started staring at the roof for a while.

I didn't like Reloaded much ... which goes to show what I thought of Revolutions. I appear to be in the minority on this one. However, the majority of critics seem to think this movie was bad, as well ... Rotten Tomatoes (http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/TheMatr ... s-1127201/) has it at 35%, with only 55 of 144 reviews that were good.

o_O; i thought it had a lot of closure.

My sister and I both thought that it seemed as though the movie seemed to have stopped prematurely. I mean, they're going to let people out of the Matrix (for now) ... to do what? Help rebuild Zion? What happens when the next attack arrives (which it almost certainly will)? What sort of life will these people live now? Do they try and make a normal life now that the war is over, or do they stand ready for another war? And what's keeping the machines from immediately attacking Zion now that it's been crippled and the threat of Agent Smith has been removed? I doubt they really accept humans that much to the point where they're ready to leave them alone.

To me, there were no pointless drawn-out scenes.

I just found the Zion battle scene incredibly drawn out. I mean, for how long can you watch the good guys in these mechanized suits shoot millions and millions of rounds of ammunition into millions and millions of sentinels doing nothing more than moving in a straight line before it gets boring? The scene had to be 45 minutes long, and nothing of consequence happened, aside from the fact that Zion was getting wasted, a lot of people died, a lot of sentinels got destroyed, and they managed to open the gate to let that ship come in, shoot its EMP, and disable all the bad and good guys. That could have been done in a quarter of the time ... it would have shown off the CG just as well, but would have allowed the plot to develop more quickly.

There were others, too, but this is the most blatant one in my opinion.

I sobbed my eyes out when Trinity died, and she's one of the characters that gets on my nerves the most. But the sheer emotion of it was overwhelming.

I did all I could not to laugh at that scene. I mean, Neo's blind, can see everything, and Trinity's just talking to him. All of a sudden, she says she can't go, and then we see a bunch of things sticking out of her stomach. However, she manages to hang on long enough to talk to Neo for a while before finally dying. My brother-in-law, sister and I all had to stifle our laughter at this scene.

(p.s. Tiff - Since you're the only one who responded directly to what I had to say, I wanted a chance to explain the parts where our two opinions differed. It's not intended to be a direct attack against you and your opinions.)

[Tiff]

(p.s. Tiff - Since you're the only one who responded directly to what I had to say, I wanted a chance to explain the parts where our two opinions differed. It's not intended to be a direct attack against you and your opinions.)

I understand ^^
I'm not going to quote all of your points, as that would make my post huge. ^^;
To me, the people who were set free would go to Zion and I suppose help rebuild it. It was left up to the imagination. To me, it seems you have a hard time letting things just come to you in your imagination. And I disagree with your bit abuot the machines. I think the machines WILL leave them alone, becuase they work with the architect, who said himself that the people will be freed. The machines wouldn't have helped Neo the way they did if they had an intention of attacking all of the humans again.

I loved the Zion battle scene. I thought it was awesome to see all of those machines streaming into Zion, and the emotion of the battles was great.

*Shrug* sorry, I guess i'm more empathetic than you are. I get emotional when characters do. I cry. I get sad. I can't imagine laughing at any death scene in a movie, no matter the character.

[Brak]

Trinity's death was sad, however the scene was just too long to have much emotion behind it. The dialogue had potential to be very emotional and depressing, with neo's blindness and all, but it just seemed lacking. To me it was the length of it, it just seemed improbable to be impaled by multiple objects, and still manage to talk for so long.

The Zion battle was cool. But I found myself forgetting about Neo and Trinity during it. It would have probably been more effective if they cut back and forth between the two plots.

Personally, I wanted to see more of the programs and the interaction in the machine world. Seeing the big face at the end just wasn't enough for me. And I thought it would have been cool if the machine that took Neo away placed him on a pedestal with the other Ones who had fought before him.

[shansen]

By the way ... about the whole death scene ... I just wanted to say that I don't typically think death scenes are funny. I'm not going to say I've ever cried about one, but when they're well done I tend to be able to relate (at least a little bit) to the main character. Needless to say, I didn't think this particular one was done well at all.

Anyway, Tiff, we both seem to have very strong (albeit opposing) opinions, and we don't seem too willing to change our minds either way. So, I think we should just agree to disagree on this ...

[Akarui Kibuno]

Well, I saw it today.

What I understood is that... hmm, well. Let's see.

The Matrix was separated from the real world. This world is then divided into Zion and the town of the Machines.

Neo gets to the Machine Town, and makes a deal with the "Machine Chief" (didn't know how to call that). It asks Neo what Neo wants. Neo wants peace: the machine wants Smith because it has no control over it. Neo can destroy Smith, so the machine gives him the chance to do so.

Then, Neo gets into the Matrix, and I understood that he let Smith "posess" him because then he'd be able to destroy Smith from the inside. I think that's why there's someone lying on the ground after they all explode. This person lying down must be Neo, who destroyed the Smith envelope.

Then, the machines leave Zion, because the two sides have to respect their part of the deal. The Machine gives the peace in exchange of Smith.

Then, Neo gets "unplugged" and the machine takes him. And I think the reason why we can't really figure out if he's dead or not means it's an "open end". Might mean it's either:

- open so that people can imagine what happened themselves
- open so as to keep a possibility of making another movie
- open just because they didn't want to "end" Neo, meaning he can be alive or dead, but it means the same thing.

I liked this movie. I really was into it, as I always am when I get to the cinema. It's always another world for me, and I feel what's happening deeply. I feel the emotions, I feel everything.

I don't know what else to say. I hope I didn't get anything wrong.

And I'm happy my boyfriend let me watch it with subtitles (we have special cinemas that do that, we can go watch it subbed and not dubbed, yayyyyyyy!!). Because I didn't want to miss the Merovingian's terrible English accent. I LOVE this accent. It's so un-English and horrible... in Reloaded, that was my best scene, when he was mixing English and French... makes me laugh everytime I think of it.

(be reassured, my oral English is not like that at all )

[Tiff]

- open so that people can imagine what happened themselves
- open so as to keep a possibility of making another movie
- open just because they didn't want to "end" Neo, meaning he can be alive or dead, but it means the same thing.

Because I didn't want to miss the Merovingian's terrible English accent. I LOVE this accent. It's so un-English and horrible... in Reloaded, that was my best scene, when he was mixing English and French... makes me laugh everytime I think of it.

1) I agree about the open thing. I think it was just left upt o you.
2) o_O; he wasn't trying to make an English accent. He's French. He's using (or trying to use) a French accent the entire time. That's why they call him "The French Man" sometimes.

Anyway, Tiff, we both seem to have very strong (albeit opposing) opinions, and we don't seem too willing to change our minds either way. So, I think we should just agree to disagree on this ...

XD; Yeah, seems that way. Fine by me.

[Obsessive Touga Fan]

*why must they SHOW Neo & Trinity doing it? and for 20 minutes? 20 minutes of wasted footage. *shudder**

I'd have appreciated that scene a lot more if they'd shown more of Keanu ^^;; (Sorry, but it had to be said...)

What happens when the next attack arrives (which it almost certainly will)?

All things being equal, the machines will not go back on their word. As the Architect says, they're not human.

Unless the humans provoke the machines (with undoubtedly they will at some point), there will be peace. Bear in mind that humans are largely responsible for causing the war in the first place (see the Animatrix shorts "The Second Renaissance" parts 1 and 2).

[Tiff]

All things being equal, the machines will not go back on their word. As the Architect says, they're not human.

Unless the humans provoke the machines (with undoubtedly they will at some point), there will be peace. Bear in mind that humans are largely responsible for causing the war in the first place (see the Animatrix shorts "The Second Renaissance" parts 1 and 2).

*nodsnods* that's exactly what I think. The architect said there would be peace unless the humans provoke it, and so therefore, the machines aren't going to do shit.

And those Animatrix shorts are awesome.

[Aya Reiko]

Neo gets to the Machine Town, and makes a deal with the "Machine Chief" (didn't know how to call that).

I'm pretty sure the role is listed as "Deus Ex Machina" in the credits.

[Akarui Kibuno]

2) o_O; he wasn't trying to make an English accent. He's French. He's using (or trying to use) a French accent the entire time. That's why they call him "The French Man" sometimes.

LOL Tiffu-san I know he's French . The actor is. His name is Lambert Wilson, and he can speak English very well. And as a non-native speaker who speaks English well enough, I just think that it was a tidbit forced... this accent is sooooooo bad :p and I was saying I like that because it makes him funny. He's a threat to everyone in Zion, there's something about him and Neo that I quite didn't get but still... he manages to be funny! At least for me

[Tiff]

LOL Tiffu-san I know he's French . The actor is. His name is Lambert Wilson, and he can speak English very well. And as a non-native speaker who speaks English well enough, I just think that it was a tidbit forced... this accent is sooooooo bad :p and I was saying I like that because it makes him funny. He's a threat to everyone in Zion, there's something about him and Neo that I quite didn't get but still... he manages to be funny! At least for me

You confused me becuase you said "English Accent", and I was thinking of someone from England.