When freedom of speech gets stolen

Akarui Kibuno · Post by **Akarui Kibuno** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 6:10 am

I hope no one posted about that already.

Here are two links about something that seems to have happened lately in the US. As far as I can understand, it's about a teacher that is going to face a trial because he was against the war in Iraq.

A friend of mine posted this on a French forum because it seems one of his own friends studying in the US saw what happened with this teacher.

http://www.bostonmajustice.org/ - You'll know more about what happened

Here is the online petition you can sign.

I believe it is not a hoax, and sure hope it's not. Maybe you guys will know better (heck, I'm sure you'll know better for the ones who live in the US o.O)

J Anderson · Post by **J Anderson** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 6:27 am

Good lord, it's the 1960s all over again...

Meanwhile, the whole Iraq thing has become some unnecessary joke, I'm not exactly sure what we're still doing over there. "Rebuilding" I guess, though I'd like to see the figures on what's been accomplished. So far, all we've done is get Saddam and his bunch out of power with no real goal afterwards.

Post by **Tiff** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 10:41 am

Well, that's just sick.
I just love how our society was meant to be built on freedom. An act like that looks more like how the germans would have reacted during WW2 if someone spoke out against Hitler.

yoshmaster5 · Post by **yoshmaster5** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 3:46 pm

Horrid. if the Founding Fathers saw this country now... they'd probebly cry. This violates the 1st Amendment in the BILL OF RIGHTS, in the CONSTITUTION. if he is convicted... then... this country has gone down the drain.

all I hope is that Bush is NOT re-elected. he's the reason all this has happened. he is the horrid american stereotype. Acting like we are better than everyone else.
Our troops are dying and he says, "Bring it on!"? WTFH IS UP WITH HIM?? HE DOES NOT CARE IF ANYONE DIES, HE ONLY CARES ABOUT HIMSELF. HE STAYED IN AN AFRICAN COUNTRY FOR SIX HOURS! SIX! THAT IS INSULTING THEM!!!! *punches self to stop rant*

either way... there is no case against this guy. none at all. he has a right what to think. and the Guardsman was harassing the student anyway. the guardsman should not have done that. The student has the right to oppose everything about Iraq.

As the daily show says... Iraq has become... Mess-o-potamia

If anything... many people hate america at the moment. Bush mainly. The French are correct Bush is extremely dangerous...
either way... Bush is like, "We don't need YOUR help with this!" to the UN in March... now... "Please give us money to help, "Rebuild" Iraq!" and... the biggest reason NOT to trust that is... the 87 billion bucks is going to... BUSH'S AND CHANNEY'S OWN COMPANIES! IT'S LIKE THEY ARE PAYING THEMSELVES!

Anthy · Post by **Anthy** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 4:46 pm

Chill, Yoshman. ^^

J Anderson · Post by **J Anderson** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 5:27 pm

The problem with not re-electing bush is we don't have any better choices. People seem to praise Howard Dean but he looks to be the same as the rest of them, to me. I'd support Guiliani completely if he'd only run.

I'm sick of hearing the Iraqi news. Especially because it's considered such a big deal when 3 soldiers die a week. I don't mean to downplay anything, but what'd they expect over there? And the media sees an easy sympathy grab. Yet when 3 police officers are killed, it may not make it past local news. So I have a hard time buying the idea that soldiers deserve special sympathy for doing what the police do every day. Considering this war is costing many times more than what we spend on law enforcement each year.

Anthy · Post by **Anthy** » Wed Oct 29, 2003 6:55 pm

J Anderson wrote:Considering this war is costing many times more than what we spend on law enforcement each year.

Which is why it's ridiculous to try to cut taxes and then spend millions of dollars on each warhead. ¬¬; It doesn't work that way. You can't spend money you don't have. We're putting ourselves in a hole.

Anyways. ON TOPIC! ^^'''

Akarui Kibuno · Post by **Akarui Kibuno** » Thu Oct 30, 2003 6:20 am

Well, you know, it is true that the thing about this guy is sad. Because now, it means Americans can be put to jail anytime if the police or any other person representing an authority of some kind hears something against the President's official policy.

Isn't that sad ? Someone said the French are right to be against that. Ah... would you have seen a horrid website bashing us that you might have said that stronger. Not all people think that. Actually, some even think we're cowards cause we didn't accept the war... and they were saying things so horrible that I cried once cause I didn't believe that there were people that could be so stupid.

Now, I just hope there are a lot of people who sign this petition, because, if it doesn't get the man out of jail, well, it will at least show that there are still intelligent people left. I think we were given minds to use them, and I'd be sad to see this go to waste.

J Anderson · Post by **J Anderson** » Thu Oct 30, 2003 7:55 pm

Akarui Kibuno wrote:Isn't that sad ? Someone said the French are right to be against that. Ah... would you have seen a horrid website bashing us that you might have said that stronger. Not all people think that. Actually, some even think we're cowards cause we didn't accept the war... and they were saying things so horrible that I cried once cause I didn't believe that there were people that could be so stupid

I stopped believing that when I saw people dancing, cheering, and celebrating in the Gaza Strip on 9/11 as the towers fell. It was a big party to those people.

But, if we fight them or sit back and ignore it, the US is still the "Great Satan" either way, so the government's going to do whatever it wants.

Brak · Post by **Brak** » Thu Oct 30, 2003 9:43 pm

I may have missed some parts in this article, but it looks to me like police brutality instead of being attacked because you're against the war thing. From what I read the guardsman made a remark that was completely unnecessary, and someone talked back to him and the guardsman attacked him.

Post by **Tiff** » Thu Oct 30, 2003 9:57 pm

Brak wrote:I may have missed some parts in this article, but it looks to me like police brutality instead of being attacked because you're against the war thing. From what I read the guardsman made a remark that was completely unnecessary, and someone talked back to him and the guardsman attacked him.

o_O; that's kinda what I gathered. I don't get where all the "he got attacked becuase he was against the war" comes in.

Jed-kun · Post by **Jed-kun** » Sat Nov 01, 2003 4:13 pm

Ok, this might not be the popular thing to say, but here it goes. Teachers, if they wish to express an opinion, should express both sides and not particularly say which is there own (College is different, but both op. should still be examined). Freedom of Speech is good, but you can't be a Teacher and do it at your job, your oppinion is just that, an opinion and as a teacher you are charged with the care of the minds of young people. Help them make there own oppinions, not just absorb yours. It's just as bad to say "I hate the war in Iraq and you should too" as it is to say "I love the war in Iraq and you should too". [the preceeding has been about "Freedom of Speach" and not particularly the article].

Furthermore, to discuss the article, it sounded more like police brutality to me as well.

Post by **Tiff** » Sat Nov 01, 2003 10:09 pm

That's a very valid point, Jed-kun. Don't feel as though you shouldn't say that. I pretty much agree with you.

Akarui Kibuno · Post by **Akarui Kibuno** » Sun Nov 02, 2003 5:06 pm

If it was police brutality, it's my own mistake to have mistaken it as something else.

I'll explain to you why I said that. The person who originally reported it to me said that his friend saw "the scene". I didn't know what to think of that, actually. The assumption was that a student was giving flyers "against the war" or something, that the guard said students like that should be dead, and the teacher answered. Now I'm not so sure anymore. You guys should know better than I do anyway ^^;;

And I've also been thinking why the hell is this teacher supposed to be in prison, why is this going to an online petition to keep him from being sent to jail if it was only a case of police brutality. I mean, victims don't go to jail, don't they?

But you all have a point. Police brutality is also part of the case. Can someone clear my confusion ^^;;;;;; ?

Jed-kun · Post by **Jed-kun** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 1:33 pm

Well, I read the article a couple more times and this is what I got. The article is made up of three core elements...
1)Racism
2)Freedom of Speach
3)Police Brutality

As far as racism goes, I don't think that it really had anything to do with that. This beleif was most likely generated by the policemens reference to Dr. King. However, I feel taht 2 & 3 are completely accurate. The police brutality was used to silence his freedom of speach. IF the profesor was truely being peacful then this is a grose injustice and I can't for the life of me see why this is being allowed... oh, right, the infamous PATRIOT ACT! I feel that under the patriot act, if I'm not mistacen, this kind of corrupt injustice is allowed. Under this unconstitutional law Freedom of Speach infact becomes unconstitutional. I didn't like the "Patriot Act" when it was first introduced and I sure as HELL don't like it now. IMO this instence is turely a violation of Free Speach, however, in this country now that dosn't mean shit. Sure you have Freedom of Speach, your free to say only good things about the government or be throughn in jail!

Edit: BTW, have any of y'all heard of the "Patriot Act ... 2", that's right, a second one. As if the first wasn't bad enough now they want to restrict our rights even more. Look it up and deside for yourself.

yoshmaster5 · Post by **yoshmaster5** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 3:45 pm

Jed-kun wrote:Well, I read the article a couple more times and this is what I got. The article is made up of three core elements...
1)Racism
2)Freedom of Speach
3)Police Brutality

As far as racism goes, I don't think that it really had anything to do with that. This beleif was most likely generated by the policemens reference to Dr. King. However, I feel taht 2 & 3 are completely accurate. The police brutality was used to silence his freedom of speach. IF the profesor was truely being peacful then this is a grose injustice and I can't for the life of me see why this is being allowed... oh, right, the infamous PATRIOT ACT! I feel that under the patriot act, if I'm not mistacen, this kind of corrupt injustice is allowed. Under this unconstitutional law Freedom of Speach infact becomes unconstitutional. I didn't like the "Patriot Act" when it was first introduced and I sure as HELL don't like it now. IMO this instence is turely a violation of Free Speach, however, in this country now that dosn't mean shit. Sure you have Freedom of Speach, your free to say only good things about the government or be throughn in jail!

Edit: BTW, have any of y'all heard of the "Patriot Act ... 2", that's right, a second one. As if the first wasn't bad enough now they want to restrict our rights even more. Look it up and deside for yourself.

Dear god... BUSH BETTER NOT BE RE-ELECTED!!! Anyone notice something? Bush's new target from what I can tell is Iran. Anyone notice something? He is aming at MUSLIM countries! biased anyone?

Also... this is kind of like the Pre-Revolutionary War time. Unfairness from high authority... extreme debt... etc... This "Patriot Act" is unconstitiutional. Everyone is acting like Bush is GOOD. he is a damn war monger! He will never realise... except for certian curcustances... *revolutinary wars* No one wins in war. You lose, you lose power and the area. you win... you have to rebuild the area, and considering there would be a war debt... you go into debt. *shakes head* this is just getting insane...

ParaKiss_Groupie · Post by **ParaKiss_Groupie** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 3:50 pm

Dear god... BUSH BETTER NOT BE RE-ELECTED!!! Anyone notice something? Bush's new target from what I can tell is Iran. Anyone notice something? He is aming at MUSLIM countries! biased anyone?

I don't like Bush. In fact, I really, really don't like Bush. I don't agree with him on, well, anything. I can understand Bush, I just don't support him. He's aiming at the countries in the Middle East, who DO have a lot of terrorists in them. But I don't think he's biased against Muslims.

Post by **Tiff** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 3:53 pm

yoshmaster5 wrote:
Dear god... BUSH BETTER NOT BE RE-ELECTED!!! Anyone notice something? Bush's new target from what I can tell is Iran. Anyone notice something? He is aming at MUSLIM countries! biased anyone?

Also... this is kind of like the Pre-Revolutionary War time. Unfairness from high authority... extreme debt... etc... This "Patriot Act" is unconstitiutional. Everyone is acting like Bush is GOOD. he is a damn war monger! He will never realise... except for certian curcustances... *revolutinary wars* No one wins in war. You lose, you lose power and the area. you win... you have to rebuild the area, and considering there would be a war debt... you go into debt. *shakes head* this is just getting insane...

As ParaKiss said...I highly doubt he's biased against muslims. Those countries just happen to contain a lot of Muslims, and they happen to have a lot of terrorists. The two aren't related.
and calm down. Some people support Bush, and that's okay. YOU believe he's a war monger, but others may not.

Akarui Kibuno · Post by **Akarui Kibuno** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 4:42 pm

And isn't it a tidbit off-topic too to talk about Bush like that ^^;;; ?

Anthy · Post by **Anthy** » Mon Nov 03, 2003 5:03 pm

Right, Akarui. Bush has very little to do with this topic. This is about freedom of speech, not about the war or Bush himself.