Most powerful monster/bad guy in a video game

[Sailormars Obsessed fan]

Ive had topics like this on other forums and I want to see how it would work here.

What would you consider to be the most powerful monster or bad guy or villain or whatever in a video game. I'm not talking about how difficult they are to beat when playing the game, I'm talking based on the story in the game around them. Basically list what creature you think fits the bill and let us know why you think so. Don't forget to prepare for spoilers here.

Personally I think the final boss in Chrono Cross is about as powerful as Ive seen. I'll put the spoiler around this part



[spoiler] The Devourer of Time a fusion of the dark god Lavos and the most powerful sorceress of all time Schala. When combined they possessed the power to not only destroy all space and time if so desired it could jump to parallel universes and do the same there. There was no escape from this creature by any means. It is only by pure chance Serge discovered the Element Song which allowed this creature to be destroyed.[/spoiler]

Well that's my submission. I look forwards to what the rest of you think.

[Starscream]

I think that this award is going to go toward one of the RPG villains, as in recent years the end bosses in many RPGs have become veritable gods in their own right.

Case in point (FF6 spoilers):

[spoiler]Kefka assumes the power of the goddesses who created the world and, as a result, destroys it, or at least leaves it a veritable world of ruin. He builds a tower out of chunks of land he destroyed and is able to instantly kill anyone he wants if he senses that they are being disobedient toward him and his will.[/spoiler]

[yoshmaster5]

Hm... of what I've played... not too much... I've rarely played RPG's, and most I have are strategy ones. *Fire Emblem*

Well... *thinks*

This boss isnt' the 'final' one, but is a very VERY hard one...
Dragon Warrior 3, maybe re-make only--

[spoiler]Divindegon, you have to fight through hell to get to him, and once you do, he's a PAIN to kill... I've beaten him, but it's a female dog.[/spoiler]

Chrono Trigger is iffy... want the boss to be VERY hard, do a speed run. *4 hours, 56 minutes* and Lavos is heck. Do a new game +, and easy as heck. Really depends with some things...

I can't remember too well, but I think
[spoiler]Hargon[/spoiler]
from DWII was difficult when I fought him. But, I did PL before fighting him...

[Gamer8585]

I would say Lavos from Chrono Trigger.

I'm not even going to list all of the reasons Lavos is so powerful, but here's a few:

1) He eats planets.

2) He can create a whole pocket dimention for himself that exists outside of time.

3) You have to fight 3 stages/forms of Lavos, the last two are inside him, because his shell is too strong to be destroyed. (hell, even Sigma [Megaman X] never had more than 2 bodies, both fought externaly).

The Devourer of Time (from Chrono Cross) was defenatly tough, but still had only a faction of the overall power of Lavos. He was really more of a "Lavos Spawn."

DoT could be defeted realy easly: just cast elemetal spells in a certain order followed by using the Chrono Cross. No need to whittle that HP down to 0.

[AnimeGuru0]

Deus from Xenogears.

For one, it created a whole civilization.

Two, it was connected to the ultimate endless power source (Zohar).

Three, no one could possibly defeat Deus. The only reason it was defeated was because certain events coincidentially happened in a sequence that wasn't favorable for it. Otherwise, it would have pwned all.

Four, it was GOD for freaking sakes, in several senses of the word. LOL

Yeah, Deus was a badass. =)

[Gamer8585]

Deus from Xenogears.

For one, it created a whole civilization.

Two, it was connected to the ultimate endless power source (Zohar).

Three, no one could possibly defeat Deus. The only reason it was defeated was because certain events coincidentially happened in a sequence that wasn't favorable for it. Otherwise, it would have pwned all.

Four, it was GOD for freaking sakes, in several senses of the word. LOL

Yeah, Deus was a badass. =)

Deus wasn't God he was a very powerful Gnosis that everyone thought was God. He was able to manipulate the Zohar and the creation of life on the planet.

If Deus was God he would be Omipitant and the game would have a very bad ending for the spunky group of medling kids (Fei et al.)

I totaly think that Lavos could kick Deus' ass, but I don't want this to turn into a flame war.

[Sailormars Obsessed fan]

The Devourer of Time (from Chrono Cross) was defenatly tough, but still had only a faction of the overall power of Lavos. He was really more of a "Lavos Spawn."

Id have to disagree with you here (friendly disagree no flaming from me ^_^)

[spoiler]Lavos was indeed powerful able to rip time apart just by existing, but the devorer could not only do this it could alter the flow of time (thus creating home world in the game) it could also rip apart other dimensions. It was clearly a lot more powerful then a lavos spawn.[/spoiler]

[AnimeGuru0]

Deus from Xenogears.

For one, it created a whole civilization.

Two, it was connected to the ultimate endless power source (Zohar).

Three, no one could possibly defeat Deus. The only reason it was defeated was because certain events coincidentially happened in a sequence that wasn't favorable for it. Otherwise, it would have pwned all.

Four, it was GOD for freaking sakes, in several senses of the word. LOL

Yeah, Deus was a badass. =)

Deus wasn't God he was a very powerful Gnosis that everyone thought was God. He was able to manipulate the Zohar and the creation of life on the planet.

If Deus was God he would be Omipitant and the game would have a very bad ending for the spunky group of medling kids (Fei et al.)

I totaly think that Lavos could kick Deus' ass, but I don't want this to turn into a flame war.

Ok, reread my post. I said Deus was God in SEVERAL SENSES OF THE WORD. He was God in the sense that he created the entire human population in the world of Xenogears, the Wave Existance was inevitably part of Deus, and seeing as the Wave Existance was from a "higher plane", Deus once again can be comparable to "God". Not to mention the countless upon countless times Deus is referred to as "God" in the game.

No, Deus is not the God of christianity, but you have to remember that not all "Gods" throughout time were Omnipotent and Omniscient. None of the Greek/Roman gods were. Yet they were still considered "gods".

Second - Xenogears =/= Xenosaga. While there may be a Deus in the Xenosaga series, which may or may not turn out to be some form of a Gnosis, that does not apply to Xenogears. They don't exist in the same universe. Anyways, you can't say that Deus is a Gnosis because EpIII of Xenosaga isn't even out yet, and nothing like that has been revealed.

[Gamer8585]

Deus from Xenogears.

For one, it created a whole civilization.

Two, it was connected to the ultimate endless power source (Zohar).

Three, no one could possibly defeat Deus. The only reason it was defeated was because certain events coincidentially happened in a sequence that wasn't favorable for it. Otherwise, it would have pwned all.

Four, it was GOD for freaking sakes, in several senses of the word. LOL

Yeah, Deus was a badass. =)

Deus wasn't God he was a very powerful Gnosis that everyone thought was God. He was able to manipulate the Zohar and the creation of life on the planet.

If Deus was God he would be Omipitant and the game would have a very bad ending for the spunky group of medling kids (Fei et al.)

I totaly think that Lavos could kick Deus' ass, but I don't want this to turn into a flame war.

Ok, reread my post. I said Deus was God in SEVERAL SENSES OF THE WORD. He was God in the sense that he created the entire human population in the world of Xenogears, the Wave Existance was inevitably part of Deus, and seeing as the Wave Existance was from a "higher plane", Deus once again can be comparable to "God". Not to mention the countless upon countless times Deus is referred to as "God" in the game.

No, Deus is not the God of christianity, but you have to remember that not all "Gods" throughout time were Omnipotent and Omniscient. None of the Greek/Roman gods were. Yet they were still considered "gods".

Second - Xenogears =/= Xenosaga. While there may be a Deus in the Xenosaga series, which may or may not turn out to be some form of a Gnosis, that does not apply to Xenogears. They don't exist in the same universe. Anyways, you can't say that Deus is a Gnosis because EpIII of Xenosaga isn't even out yet, and nothing like that has been revealed.

The Wave Existance was trapped in the Zohar not Deus. Xenogears was made by the same people that made Xenosaga and at the end of Xenogears it says "Episode V: Xenogears" indicating it was a part of something bigger. There was also a Xenogears Perfect Works guide that was released a while back, stating the whole back story and that Deus was a Gnosis.

I think that Xenosaga is supposed to be a refined telling of the story starting from several hundred years before Xenogears, and it's assumed that if Xenosaga ever gets to ep.5 it will be a Xenogears remake. However they said that ep.3 would be the final Xenosaga game.

Anything to do with Xenogears would have to be negotiated with Square-Enix who own the rights to that game, and I asume that Monolith and/or Square dosen't want to negotiate so they're ending with ep.3

Although not all religons have omnipotent gods, Xenogears/saga is greatly influenced by Judisim and Christianity. When the charachters in the game talk about God it is in a distintcly Judeo-Christian sense.

[AnimeGuru0]

The Wave Existance was trapped in the Zohar not Deus.

And Zohar was an essential part of Deus. Thus why the Zohar stopped functioning when Deus was destroyed. Destruction of the Zohar meant the destruction of Deus, and the destruction of Deus meant the destruction of the Zohar. Just like a human can't survive without his heart, and the heart cannot survive without the human.

*Snip retelling of what Xenogears and Xenosaga are*

Yes. I'm well aware of all of that. I also own Perfect Works. I also never remember it mentioning that Deus was a Gnosis. Especially considering Gnosis was a term coined in Ep I of Xenosaga, and Perfect Works was made WELL before Ep I of Xenosaga even began pre-production.

Although not all religons have omnipotent gods, Xenogears/saga is greatly influenced by Judisim and Christianity. When the charachters in the game talk about God it is in a distintcly Judeo-Christian sense.

OK. But obviously Xenogears/Saga does not exist in the world of Judiasm or Christianity. The Xeno series also gives nods to many other religions or religious ideals. Obviously, the ideas of Neitchze are very apparent in the saga universe. Yeah, they give nods to Judaiac religions, but that's where it ends. To limit the game by that standard is preposterous. Under your logic, the names Rueben, Dan, Issachar, Gad, etc. should all belong to people who are the sons of a man named Israel/Jacob, not the names of giant robots.

Frankly, I'm done arguing. I don't know why I couldn't just state my opinion pertaining to the thread and be done with it, rather than having to defend my opinion and my points as to why my opinion was such. I definately don't think Lavos is the best, but you never saw me going after you for thinking so.

[Gamer8585]

The Wave Existance was trapped in the Zohar not Deus.

And Zohar was an essential part of Deus. Thus why the Zohar stopped functioning when Deus was destroyed. Destruction of the Zohar meant the destruction of Deus, and the destruction of Deus meant the destruction of the Zohar. Just like a human can't survive without his heart, and the heart cannot survive without the human.

*Snip retelling of what Xenogears and Xenosaga are*

Yes. I'm well aware of all of that. I also own Perfect Works. I also never remember it mentioning that Deus was a Gnosis. Especially considering Gnosis was a term coined in Ep I of Xenosaga, and Perfect Works was made WELL before Ep I of Xenosaga even began pre-production.

Although not all religons have omnipotent gods, Xenogears/saga is greatly influenced by Judisim and Christianity. When the charachters in the game talk about God it is in a distintcly Judeo-Christian sense.

OK. But obviously Xenogears/Saga does not exist in the world of Judiasm or Christianity. The Xeno series also gives nods to many other religions or religious ideals. Obviously, the ideas of Neitchze are very apparent in the saga universe. Yeah, they give nods to Judaiac religions, but that's where it ends. To limit the game by that standard is preposterous. Under your logic, the names Rueben, Dan, Issachar, Gad, etc. should all belong to people who are the sons of a man named Israel/Jacob, not the names of giant robots.

Frankly, I'm done arguing. I don't know why I couldn't just state my opinion pertaining to the thread and be done with it, rather than having to defend my opinion and my points as to why my opinion was such. I definately don't think Lavos is the best, but you never saw me going after you for thinking so.

Sorry, I didn't mean for what I said to be taken as some kind of an attack. I respect your opinioin, and I was just engaeing in some friendly banter.

I should problably mention, for puposes of full disclosure, my knowldege of Xenogears: Perfect Works is also a little shakey becasue I've only had seen summeries of parts of it though sources on the internet, and someone mentioned that it said Deus was a Gnosis. Since you own it I'll ceed the arguemet on it to you.

Like I said I didn't want this to become a flame war, and I'm sorry if that's the direction it took. So, I'll shut up on this subject too.

[AnimeGuru0]

S'ok. No offense taken ^^. Hopefully none vice versa either ^^

[Gamer8585]

S'ok. No offense taken ^^. Hopefully none vice versa either ^^

Nope, none here. I just want to be friends, but I guess I like to hear myself talk to much...or type in this case. lol

[Starscream]

Guys, in the future, can you keep such plot-relevant points under the spoiler tag? There are a lot of people - myself included - who have never played the Xeno- games, and I think we'd appreciate it if such points were kept hidden from our eyes. Thanks ^^