4Kids! and their anime

#1SailorMoonFan · Post by **#1SailorMoonFan** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:23 pm

Does anybody have a list of ALL the anime they have dubbed? And other foreign shows? Here is what I have so far:
Winx Club, Ojamajo Doremi, Tokyo Mew Mew, Sonic, Pocket Monsters, and Yugioh. Why do they have such a thing against anime? And a thing for "Americanizing" everything?? For example, Winx Club: The Italians had a 100% uncensored and uncut version translated in English by themselves, and 4Kids didn't even bother to think of using it. No, we got a crappy dub and now some of us are only able to see the original version by buying DVDs from Italy. In this thread we can talk about 4Kids, their butchering of foreign shows, and talking about what they have done to each one by giving examples.

Rainbow · Post by **Rainbow** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:43 pm

Well, this is a bit personal, but they ruined my favorite thing about Tokyo Mew Mew, and that was the whole "food names" deal.

They could've at least called them English food names, although I can understand some of the jokes that might've ensued had they used the original Japanese names:

Ichigo--itchy?
Zakuro--called her Zak and then said it was a boy's name

But that's more me and my love of characters with weird names, especially cutesy ones.

Tempest · Post by **Tempest** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:49 pm

I don't think it's necessarly becuase they have anything "against" anime. You have to remember that the titles you listed are targeted to young children and what the company thinks that young children will respond to. Most children won't look at things like Pokemon and Mew Mew Power and see soemthing "butchered" or "Americanized". They see "that show they like". Just because we, meaning older audiences, think it's ruined doesn't mean that young children think the same way. It has nothing to do with intelligence, just how the young mind sees things.

I know when I watched television as a child I watched things that entertained me. Looking back at it now Thundercats & Jem were cheesy as hell, but as a child it didn't matter. You like what you like without judging it or see flaws.

As far as some of the changing goes, the average American child won't get the Japanese references. So they have to re-write and edit pieces of the show so the American children can understand the small things like foods and common expressions.

I hate butchering just as much as the next person, but I understand why they do it if the show is targeted to a very young age group.

::edit:: Umm. ^^;; After re-reading it I realized that it may look like I was putting my foot down on the topic. Please don't think I was trying to stop any and all conversations reguarding the subject at hand. I was just putting my two cents in.
Please continue to discuss your observations, comparisions and complaints. :P

Panda · Post by **Panda** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:20 pm

Don't worry about things you can't change. I'm speaking to everyone... probably myself to

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4kids

There is a rathyer nice list of ALL the works they'e done. they do alot of American shows to from what I understand.

Tempest · Post by **Tempest** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:34 pm

Panda wrote:Don't worry about things you can't change. I'm speaking to everyone... probably myself to :shock:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4kids

There is a rathyer nice list of ALL the works they'e done. they do alot of American shows to from what I understand.

I use that same philosophy with just about everything. xD

Back on topic (sorta) - There's no harm is discussing it. :P There's no way to change the edits of Sailor Moon, yet we frequent a site that discusses and compares the North American dub/adaptation with the original Japanese version. This site was built on taking two different versions of the same show and say, "Hay, look what they changed!".

Wow, I didn't realize how much 4Kids had done. o_o

Panda · Post by **Panda** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:23 pm

Yah well... whatever. I don't care if they're aiming it for kids or not. The Japanese version was clearly aimed for young teens and it should have been kept that way.

I think aiming Sailor Moon and Poke'mon (etc...you get the point) at kids ages 9-12 would have been a smarter move. Then it wouldn't be so weird when they call rice ckaes "donuts"... I seriously remember thinking those were "werid Japanese donuts".

Tempest · Post by **Tempest** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:58 pm

Yes it would be great that when an anime is licensed that they kept the general target age because I would have loved it if they had dubbed/adapted Sailormoon closer to the original version, but they don't always go with that way of thinking.
When they license anime that they want to target toward children they look at the marketing value. Taking Pokemon for example, look at the merchandise marketing on that. Games, stuffed animals, kids meals, cheap toys, trading cards, bed sheets, clothes and other novelties. That's a goldmine. Most kids can get their parents to buy that cheap crap. Companies target whatever audience that will bring in the most money.

They put the original target ages to the side and will usually buy the licences that will bring them the most profit.

Musashi · Post by **Musashi** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:55 am

I love how ridiculous Kahn is. KIDS JUST USE THE INTERNET. THEY DON'T READ ANYMORE!!! ... What the heck? xD

Ahh, the doughnuts! Don't forget eclairs... and popcorn balls! Yes, but then 4Kids thought, 'HEY, we changed food a lot in One Piece, let's take ALL the onigiri in Pokemon and turn them into peanut butter and jelly sandwiches/sub sandwiches/and CRACKERS.' I wish Dogasu's Backpack (the Pokemon-version of SMU... I think it might be in this site's links too?) was up right now... but I'm pretty sure it's down for the moment, so I can't show you guys anythin'. Oh, and they LOVE changing the music since after the first season ended... which ruins the emotion in a couple of scenes. <_<;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leJkEL_uDBQ
Like so. ... Although I find it kind of funny they don't mind guns NOW, but mind the sound a gun MAKES.
It's not even the sound of it being fired, just cocked! Which makes it rather confusing as Satoshi's Pokemon later learns Bullet Seed... meaning it'll be making that sound...
Oi, 4Kids. I still don't see the harm in Japanese food and why they must cover it up and Americanize it in their dubs, especially as Pokemon has had onigiri since the very beginning... and they called it riceball ones! And correctly said sushi... So why? Blah. -hits head-

Kameko · Post by **Kameko** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 8:15 pm

Musashi wrote:I love how ridiculous Kahn is. KIDS JUST USE THE INTERNET. THEY DON'T READ ANYMORE!!! ... What the heck? xD

He also thinks manga is interesting as a concept. Thier is no reason why 4kids couldn't release an uncut and properly subtitled (no dubtitles) DVD releases of the series they have.

Sailorasteroid · Post by **Sailorasteroid** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 8:53 pm

If you include Japanese elements (like onigiri), are you really going to lose your target audience and lose profit because of it?

On the other hand, if you change Japanese elements, will you turn off the hardcore fan and lose some of them?

I think the answers are Not Really and Yes, respectively.

artemis_is_my_dawg · Post by **artemis_is_my_dawg** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 9:55 pm

I actually enjoyed watching Mew Mew Power. I liked the voices, and I did read every book to the series, so I knew the differences, and still enjoyed it. I liked Zoey better than Ichigo, for sure.

Musashi · Post by **Musashi** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 10:04 am

4Kids was kidnapped and replaced by DiC during the dubbing of Pokemon Chronicles.
Or well, that's what it LOOKS like...
http://dogasu.bulbagarden.net/compariso ... _list.html

Take a look see through the comparisions already up. It's pretty freaky. Especially all the crazy CGI scene changers in the Hanada Gym Revenge Match episode.

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 10:07 am

I also don't think 4Kids has anything against anime. Their butcher-jobs have been largely successful. Of course they will do what works. I do think it is borderline retarded, however, to obliterate any references to Japan or its culture. Most kids KNOW that they are watching Japanese cartoons; their heads won't explode if they see some kid eating a rice cake.

I seem to remember there being a lot of references to American things in Pokemon. The strange thing is that the games aren't dumbed down this way.

Musashi · Post by **Musashi** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 11:26 am

Yeah, but 4Kids has revealed several times that they don't know ANYTHING about the show they're dubbing. Lorelei of the Elite Four was called an Elite by the Rockets, but when she appeared, her name was Prima. And the hilliarious Trainer's Choice segments they have in AG now...
Arbok evolves into Seviper?! O___o;;
Those references are usually dub-only, unless you actually see the characters eating hamburgers or such (which they did once, because they were in/around a huge city.)
Now they edit the Japanese food to look like American food. -sigh-
Also, they used to paint away Japanese text.
The anime started using a made-up language since Jouto.
Sometimes, the text looks a little TOO much like Japanese for their tastes, so they edit it away.
Let me rephrase that, they edit away SCRIBBLES. NOT REAL TEXT. Oh, English text is bad too. Because 'kids don't read.'

However, the most amusing dialogue change (in a morbid way) was May calling one of her favorite foods 'chicken noodle soup' (to avoid just saying ramen or noodles. -rolls eyes- And that's VERY popular, last I checked!) The funny thing is, May's Pokemon is based on a chicken. Haruka, guard your Pokemon with your LIFE, because your dubbed counterpart wants to eat it. xDD;;;

Anyway, here's one of the stupid onigiri-sandwich edits.
http://dogasu.bulbagarden.net/compariso ... paint.html
Also Roketto-dan's onigiri are crackers.

Cardcaptor Takato · Post by **Cardcaptor Takato** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 2:18 pm

Panda wrote:Yah well... whatever. I don't care if they're aiming it for kids or not. The Japanese version was clearly aimed for young teens and it should have been kept that way.

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, most of the anime 4Kids dub are targeted towards children in Japan as well. It's just that Japan has a different culture than America and so their censorship regulations and ratings system is less strict, but 4Kids is trying to keep the same target kid-friendly audience that those anime series have in Japan for America as well. It was the same thing with Dic and Sailor Moon too, but this is one of the things about 4Kids that annoys me. If Japanese kids can watch these shows just fine as they are without any uneccessary edits, why can't American kids do the same? Is 4Kids trying to imply that American kids are more stupid than Japanese kids or something? Then again, considering how stupid the kids at their annoying forums are and how they think kids don't like to read, they probably do feel that way about American kids. Even if I don't agree with censorship or Americanization, I can sort of understand why 4Kids makes the changes they do since they're trying to appeal to the same target age group the shows in Japan did, but that still doesn't excuse some of their more ridicilous goof ups, like airing episode 12 of Mew Mew Power as episode one instead and completely forgetting any of the plot changes they made. I think if you're going to make plot changes to your dub you should at least stay consistent with them.

I used to be really annoyed by everything 4Kids did or say but nowadays I just don't care what they do anymore because most of the shows they dub I'm just not interested in as much anymore (expect for maybe One Piece, Yugioh, and Tokyo Mew Mew), and even if 4Kids screws up their dubs, there's usually some alternative way to enjoy those series. For example, One Piece, Shaman King, and Tokyo Mew Mew all have fansubs that're easily available for download over the Internet and their manga counterparts have been released in English in a mostly uncut form for those who can't download the fansubs. Pokemon's and Doremi's edits have been mostly minimal from what I've read (at least compared to their other dubs) and the Yugioh manga has been released in English uncut, and if you're really desperate to see the uncut anime, there's always the Yugioh bootleg DVDs. Besides, from what I've read of the Yugioh manga, it doesn't look like THAT much was changed in the dub and this is just my personal opinion but I think many Yugioh fans over-exaggerate just how crappy the dub really is. I guess if there's one thing I can't stand about 4Kids (aside from their stupid comments that don't make any sense), it's their refusal to release QUALITY subbed DVDs. If they would just release quality uncut DVDs, I could care less what they do with their dubs, but until they do (which is likely never) I have better anime to waste my time with.

Musashi · Post by **Musashi** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 4:46 pm

Yes, but Pokemon's edits aren't as few as they used to be... and Chronicles was just SO. VERY. BAD. And fansubbing such a long series?! Nobody would do that. They've subbed specials, movies, and earlier Advanced Generation episdes, sure, but not the original series. Which makes me /sad./ And 4Kids hates us and won't give us subs. -mutter- So we still lose. And what about those who just think the dub voices are annoying and would rather hear the original voices?
And then 4Kids lost the rights to Pokemon and Pokemon's gotten NEW voice actors who sound even worse. Subs PLEASE. -begbeg- But I'm pretty sure we'll never get any.... at least not until way after this show ends. IF it ends. <.<; And nowadays they only keep two pieces of music in every episode. Sometimes, we get a WHOPPING THREE PIECES OF ORIGINAL MUSIC! Everything else is their repeatitive all-sounds-the-same music. Whee. Back in the first season, almost all of the original music was kept in, their own music just filling up the silence. The movies besides three and six weren't very well dubbed at all. Especially the first movie.
The Mewtwo Returns special was very well dubbed (although I still want the original, mainly because Kuroi CHUREEPU/Domino's voice is done by Kotono Mitsuishi. ^^) though they made Domino a valley girl while she was in disguise (ow. How ironic.) and had death coverups.

'Or you will... LEAVE THIS WORLD!!1!!'
'SURELY LEAVE THIS WORLD!!1!!!'

Oi, vey. Just say die, okay? xD; Or... to the 'SHADOW REALM!!!' -snicker-

#1SailorMoonFan · Post by **#1SailorMoonFan** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 5:11 pm

Um, not to sound dumb, Musashi, but does fansubbing mean subtitling them? Or translating into English? Because I would LOVE to see the first two (and all) movies of Pocket Monsters subtitled, and in high quality. I would like to download them when I get the time. Know of any good sites that would have the Pocket Monsters movies subtitled and in high quality? I would like the same to apply to the first season...

Slrjoecool · Post by **Slrjoecool** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 5:42 pm

#1SailorMoonFan wrote:Um, not to sound dumb, Musashi, but does fansubbing mean subtitling them? Or translating into English? Because I would LOVE to see the first two (and all) movies of Pocket Monsters subtitled, and in high quality. I would like to download them when I get the time. Know of any good sites that would have the Pocket Monsters movies subtitled and in high quality? I would like the same to apply to the first season...

Fansubbing is when fans subtitle a movie. Fandubbing is when fans dub a movie into English. ^^

Musashi · Post by **Musashi** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 5:57 pm

Check your messages. ^_~

And yes, that's right, subbed = subtitled. 4Kids does not sell them, so fans did some, and yes, the movies are subbed.

I would love the first season of the first series, but no, the first series hasn't be subbed at ALL besides banned episodes.

#1SailorMoonFan · Post by **#1SailorMoonFan** » Sun Jun 11, 2006 6:18 pm

Musashi wrote:Check your messages. ^_~

And yes, that's right, subbed = subtitled. 4Kids does not sell them, so fans did some, and yes, the movies are subbed.

I would love the first season of the first series, but no, the first series hasn't be subbed at ALL besides banned episodes.

I got your messages. I would prefer not to use YouTube. And that person only has the one movie. I was looking for all the movies, but mainly #'s 1 and 2. And that other PM you sent me, could you send me another PM explaining how to use pocketmonsters.net? That website is confusing me.