Evangelion

MonkeyDLuffy · Post by **MonkeyDLuffy** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 10:01 pm

Tiff wrote:
ParaKiss_Groupie wrote: I thought Evangelion was an interesting series. I really enjoyed it. It was very deep and moving, not like a lot of anime which is all action and fanservice. It had a real story, and was realistic. People really could build all those things one day. I thought the characters were wonderful, and I actually felt toward every one of them. .
*nodS* see, it's for these reasons I want to see it...but I a) don't have access to it right now, and am not going to buy something unless I know I will like it and b) I just cannot get passed Shinji's whining.

That is where I am odd, I liked his sadness and whining, it gives him normalness. Would you be all happy and jumpy if you had his past?

Dinozore · Post by **Dinozore** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 10:09 pm

I have no real interest in watching this, unless I could see it on that Anime Network or something.

If I want Japanese-style religious symbolism and giant robots, I'll pop Xenogears in my PS2 and start a new game. It cost a lot less than an entire series, and it's a pretty long game. Damn good one, too, actually.

Rindesayu · Post by **Rindesayu** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:12 pm

This is just a thought, but before you go bashing something...

Gah,once again,I'm not bashing anything.What I meant by "nonsensical Christian crap" was that I thought the religious symbolism didn't really add any substance,and it definitely wasn't realistic.I'm fully aware that the symbols used were references to real things in the Bible,but flashing a glowing purple cross on the screen or using a "Lance of Longinus" to defeat something all the way out of orbit is just ridiculous and doesn't automatically make an anime deep.You guys DO know that everything I say here is based on opinion,right?

Sorry if I'm getting out-of-hand here.

Post by **Tiff** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:50 pm

Rindesayu wrote: Gah,once again,I'm not bashing anything.What I meant by "nonsensical Christian crap" was that I thought the religious symbolism didn't really add any substance,and it definitely wasn't realistic.

Youn eed to read all of this post. He was making the point that a lot of the stuff wasn't Christian at all. You're responding to something he didn't say.

That is where I am odd, I liked his sadness and whining, it gives him normalness. Would you be all happy and jumpy if you had his past?

It's not the sadness that gets me. Of course I don't expect his character to be happy and jumpy. But it gets old when ALL of his lines are "oooh poor me". It's the self-pity. If I had his past, I'd make the best of it, just like I do with all of the sad things in my past.

shansen · Post by **shansen** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 2:42 am

I know this is old news, but seeing how we're talking about Eva, I thought it might be worth mentioning here:

There's apparently going to be a live-action Eva movie!

http://eva.trivialbeing.net/ seems to be one of the only non-message board sites I can find that deals with this, and even it has virtually no details. However it definitely seems to be in the works ...

FoxFire · Post by **FoxFire** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 2:51 am

I love Evangelion. I started watching it about 6 months after getting into anime (on VHS, subtitled) after hearing about how great it was supposed to be, and for the most part I thought it stood up to the hype. I didn't always understand it (sometimes I rarely did) but it always kept me intrigued.

I like most of the characters. Shinji didn't bother me too much. Maybe it's because I've suffered from depression and gone through periods of self-loathing myself, but I thought the point of it was for him to just get over it anyway. I love Asuka the best (I've got an action figure of her standing next to my harddrive right now) and I like Rei too. I've noticed that Asuka's fans seem to hate Rei and vice versa, and everyone seems to hate Shinji, so I think I might be the only person who actually likes all 3 of the Eva pilots.

I have not seen the movies yet. After I finished watching the series I could only find them on DVD and I didn't have a DVD player yet. After I finally got one I never got around to getting them. I guess I'll have to put them on my Xmas list now, or just Netflix them.

Post by **Tiff** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 2:54 am

FoxFire wrote:
I like most of the characters. Shinji didn't bother me too much. Maybe it's because I've suffered from depression and gone through periods of self-loathing myself, but I thought the point of it was for him to just get over it anyway. I love Asuka the best (I've got an action figure of her standing next to my harddrive right now) and I like Rei too. I've noticed that Asuka's fans seem to hate Rei and vice versa, and everyone seems to hate Shinji, so I think I might be the only person who actually likes all 3 of the Eva pilots.

As I said before, I haven't seen enough to develop great opinions of the characters, but from what I've seen, I like Asuka and Rei both, for different reasons. As for Shinji...I haven't seen enough to start to like him, but for the entire first DVD, I just wanted to throw something at the TV. I just cannot stand self-pity. I really can't.

Rainbow · Post by **Rainbow** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 6:50 am

FoxFire wrote: I think I might be the only person who actually likes all 3 of the Eva pilots.

I like them all too. I like the characters, it's just that the show itself is too serious for me a lot of the time. Yes, I know the characters are serious people, but...I wonder how Asuka and Misato would act if they were in less of a serious situation, since I think they're rather funny already.

Em · Post by Em » Thu Nov 13, 2003 7:02 pm

So am I the only one that likes [spoiler]the last angle and counts him as a pilots then? what WAS his name again [/spoiler]

FoxFire · Post by **FoxFire** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 7:26 pm

Rainbow wrote:I like them all too. I like the characters, it's just that the show itself is too serious for me a lot of the time. Yes, I know the characters are serious people, but...I wonder how Asuka and Misato would act if they were in less of a serious situation, since I think they're rather funny already.

This reminds me of another discussion I was in a while back where someone said that Evangelion was too serious and had no comic relief characters, to which I had to ask what do you call Misato or Asuka then? Part of what I love about Evangelion is that while it can get so serious at times, it has characters who provide comic relief like Misato and Asuka. This is what divides it from shows like Escaflowne or Blue Gender to me, which sometimes just get too damn serious for their own good.

I think you mean Kaoru Em, and I liked him too. When I said the 3 Eva pilots I meant the 3 main ones. I don't care much for Toji though.

TrebekCrow · Post by **TrebekCrow** » Thu Nov 13, 2003 10:09 pm

Em - Yeah, Nagisia Kaworu is his name. I liked him alot as well, but wouldn't consider him an EVA pilot the way I'd consider Shinji, Rei, and Auska EVA pilots.

I don't think Auska and Misato were that funny overall. Sure, they had their moments, but the series as a whole was so dark, I don't think that little bit of humor in the light part of the series is true 'comic relief'.

NOTE! Most things I write are going to be spoilers on some level or another, but to save time for those of you that want to read this, I'm only going to put the juciest ones in tags.

ParaKiss_Groupie - You're neglecting that Christianity is an outgrowth of Judiasim, and that many parts of the religions overlap in the series. Lilith is more a figure in ancient Hebrew myth than anything, but she still does fit into the Jewish tradition, as you said. On the matter of thee Lance of Longinus, Jesus's death was a result of crucifixion, but the Gospels (Matthew's in particular, if I remember correctly) clearly state that he was stabbed with a spear somewhere on the torso to ensure he had died. The fact that the Angels are named is of little use in trying to remove Christianity from the series. The Magi are even named for the, well....Magi who visited Jesus. Also note the frequent use of significant symbolic numbers (3 and 12) throughout the series. And that's just scratching the surface. On the matter of Qabala, it does play a huge role. The fact that the Tree of Life is present in the opening credits attests to this quite well.

More generally, has anyone been able to discern the identity of the first-string Violin from End of Evangelion? I had always assumed it was Kawaoru, but wasn't positive about it. Any theories?

FoxFire · Post by **FoxFire** » Fri Nov 14, 2003 3:36 am

When I referred to Misato and Asuka as comic relief characters, I didn't mean in the traditional sense of American comic relief characters who exist for the sole purpose of adding comic relief. They're both clearly three dimensional characters with real flaws and emotions. But they do add a lot of humor early in the series. The series took a huge turn for the dark later on, but there were a lot of humorous moments in the earlier episodes. This is all why I love Evangelion so much, it's a complex series with some very serious and dark themes and the characters are all flawed, but they're not afraid to add some humor either.

ParaKiss_Groupie · Post by **ParaKiss_Groupie** » Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:47 am

ParaKiss_Groupie - You're neglecting that Christianity is an outgrowth of Judiasim, and that many parts of the religions overlap in the series. Lilith is more a figure in ancient Hebrew myth than anything, but she still does fit into the Jewish tradition, as you said. On the matter of thee Lance of Longinus, Jesus's death was a result of crucifixion, but the Gospels (Matthew's in particular, if I remember correctly) clearly state that he was stabbed with a spear somewhere on the torso to ensure he had died. The fact that the Angels are named is of little use in trying to remove Christianity from the series. The Magi are even named for the, well....Magi who visited Jesus. Also note the frequent use of significant symbolic numbers (3 and 12) throughout the series. And that's just scratching the surface. On the matter of Qabala, it does play a huge role. The fact that the Tree of Life is present in the opening credits attests to this quite well.

Yes, that is all true. But all the same, most of it is not present in modern-day Christianity. The Ancient Hebrew texts are still present in Judaism, even though they are contained in the Kaballah, and not the Torah. My point was that very little of Evangelion draws from Christian literature, but its constantly called an extremely Christian series.

Stephen Victor · Post by **Stephen Victor** » Fri Nov 14, 2003 11:29 am

One thing that I don't understand about Evangelion...

[spoiler] They make out Asuka to be this lonely girl with no friends or people to depend on and open up to, and yet ... what's Hikari, then? Asuka was obviously close friends with Hikari and we see her opening up to her a bit in ep 24, so it doesn't make much sense that they acted as if Asuka was totally independent and wasn't close at all to anyone. I like her already, but I think I would like her even more if she didn't have Hikari as a friend, or at least if she wasn't close with Hikari. [/spoiler]

Aoi Hikari · Post by **Aoi Hikari** » Sun Nov 16, 2003 8:24 pm

[spoiler]They make out Asuka to be this lonely girl with no friends or people to depend on and open up to, and yet ... what's Hikari, then? Asuka was obviously close friends with Hikari and we see her opening up to her a bit in ep 24, so it doesn't make much sense that they acted as if Asuka was totally independent and wasn't close at all to anyone. I like her already, but I think I would like her even more if she didn't have Hikari as a friend, or at least if she wasn't close with Hikari[/spoiler].

[spoiler]Asuka is not what I would call lonely. It's more that's she's is obsessed with trying to be an adult. She hid her feelings of pain from the loss of her mother by trying to always being the best and being completely independent. Because she tried to be so independent she ended up pushing everyone away and ends up being all alone. As for her and Hikari I wouldn't say they were very close but it's more that Asuka does not compare herself to Hikari like she does to Shinji and Rei. Which is probobly why she runs away to Hikari's house after the mind-rape.[/spoiler]

Anyway I love Evangelion. It is my favorite anime ever. I think it was the chracters that pulled me in more than anything. They just seemed so real and believable. I, along with an earlier poster, am one of the rare few that also loves all of the pilots. Sure I have favorites but overall I like them all.
My favorite Eva chracter is Kaworu Nagisa AKA The 5th Child/17th Angel. He is my favorite anime character of all time too.
Heh

I think I may be ranting............

Cardcaptor Takato · Post by **Cardcaptor Takato** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 9:33 pm

Lately I've been very interested in watching this anime, but I haven't watched it yet for one reason: the violence. I've heard some people say it was violent and other people say it wasn't. I have a rather weak stomach and can't handle a lot of violence. I can handle bloodshed, but I can't handle watching people's body parts being chopped off or watching somebody being tortured. The most violent anime I have in my collection is Princess Mononoke and that's only PG13, but I can barely handle watching that movie. So, what I wanted to know is if you thought this series was violent and if you could describe any of the most violent scenes in it for me so I could get an idea of what it's like? I just don't want to start watching this series and go running into the bathroom throwing up about half-way through the episode is all.

MOD EDIT: Merged into an old Eva topic.

Ni-ban Neko · Post by **Ni-ban Neko** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 8:48 am

To be totally honest with you, there are some violent scenes in Eva. A lot of them are pretty major spoilers, so I won't go into a lot of detail, but the ones I'm thinking of are stabbings, one person getting shot (IIRC - it has been quite a while since I last watched EVA, so my memory is a bit fuzzy on that one scene), and quite a few people dying.

If you have trouble with Mononoke, you'll want to proceed with caution with Eva.

ParaKiss_Groupie · Post by **ParaKiss_Groupie** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 10:50 am

If you look through the thread on "Scenes That Give You Shivers" (or whatever it's called), a lot of those are from Eva. The violence in Eva is much more disturbing than Mononoke. But this violence happens to the Evas and the Angels, so it's not quite as bad, however, it's still very disturbing.

Neo Dead Moon · Post by **Neo Dead Moon** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:18 am

I like EVA, but I hated the constant angsting and unlikable main characters (Shinji, Asuka, and Gendo especially) drenched in self-pity, poor animation in the later episodes, and thrown-in religious references for NO GOOD REASON just to be "cool" and "different". And the ending...dear God, the ending. Anno Hideaki couldn't make a good ending to an anime he directs if his life depended on it.

ParaKiss_Groupie · Post by **ParaKiss_Groupie** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 12:18 pm

Neo Dead Moon wrote:I like EVA, but I hated the constant angsting and unlikable main characters (Shinji, Asuka, and Gendo especially) drenched in self-pity, poor animation in the later episodes, and thrown-in religious references for NO GOOD REASON just to be "cool" and "different". And the ending...dear God, the ending. Anno Hideaki couldn't make a good ending to an anime he directs if his life depended on it.

The religious references were not thrown-in for no reason. They were all researched beforehand. The entire show was about whether humanity had suceeded God. The sixteen angels, the Lance of Loginus, the Tree of Life... All these things have to do with mankind's relationship to God. They had a reason. Without them, many (if not all) of the unique qualities of the show would be gone. It would just be another "Oh no! Aliens are threatening mankind! We must use giant mechas to stop them!"

I enjoyed the ending of FLCL, and he directed that. It's just a matter of opinion.

As for the ending to Evangelion, those two episodes, though confusing as all get-out, were vital. They really went through and explained the Man versus God theme of the show. For instance, the alternate reality. That was created by humankind. They are now equal to God. Those last two episodes contained more plot points than the rest of the series. But it was so fast-paced that it became confusing, and so most people miss those points completely. They granted no closure because they weren't supposed to. That was the movie's (End of Evangelion) purpose.

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