The Problems with Sailor Stars

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Post by Rainbow » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:59 am

I meant that Seiya is a lesbian like Haruka and Michiru are lesbians, not that Usagi is one too. Sorry for being unclear.
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Post by Tiff » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:07 am

Sailor V wrote:
Tiff wrote: Anime.

Yes, they are BIOLOGICALLY FEMALE.

As Rainbow said, they turn themselves into men as a disguise, but their TRUE, NATURAL, BIOLOGICAL, GENETIC form is Female.
Then how was Seiya attracted to Usagi?
..Do you, like, somehow think that women can't be attracted to other women?

Hello, Haruka and Michiru? The ENTIRE U.S. Lesbian population?

That question just baffled me.

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Post by Starry Eyes » Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:45 am

In the last episode of stars.. did Usagi use the imperium silver crystal or her star seed?cause the shape of the whatever it is. wasn't the usual shape of the crystal.
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Post by Crecent beam » Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:13 pm

They say in the episode that it's her star seed.
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Post by Starry Eyes » Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:15 pm

ohhh ok well that makes sense. But then in the first movie she uses the same shaped thing .. so she's fighting with her star seed again or was this just poor animaion?
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Post by Crecent beam » Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:11 pm

Poor animation.
The thing is: since in the R movie everything was about flowers, in order to make things look cooler, they made the silver crystal look like a flower.
And, coincidentally, Usagi's star seed also looks like a flower.
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Post by jupiter23 » Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:47 pm

Starry Eyes wrote:In the last episode of stars.. did Usagi use the imperium silver crystal or her star seed?cause the shape of the whatever it is. wasn't the usual shape of the crystal.
I prefer to go with the explanation they gave in the manga, that the Silver Crystal is Usagi's Star Seed. I also kind of thought that after the events of the first movie, they left the shape of the Silver Crystal as a flower (since it turns into a flower in the first arc of the manga anyway) and that they also went on the assumption that since we don't see the Silver Crystal between Sailor Moon R and Sailor Stars, that most of the audience would have forgotten that it never changed shape in the anime series to begin with.
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Post by Starry Eyes » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:05 pm

ohh ok well that makes sense. This is why i need to read the manga, the manga sounds sooo different from the anime and it also sounds like it explains things a lot better. Well i bought the first volume of the sailor moon manga.. it is in english which i hear it sucks in but will it still give me the same information?
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Post by Rainbow » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:12 pm

I think the Silver Crystal IS shown between the R movie and SailorStars, in the S movie. And there it has more of a diamond shape, nothing at all like a flower. So maybe it changes shape a lot? I know real crystals don't do that, but it's magic. :wink:

As for it being Usagi's Star Seed, I'm not sure about that, mainly because if Senshi can't survive without their Star Seeds, how come Usagi and even Sailor Moon could exist before the Silver Crystal was formed? She was still alive even when it was split into the 7 Rainbow Crystals. Or if you go on the manga, it got split and sucked into Mamoru's body in that version.

Or else it's a sign that some of the plotholes in Sailor Moon come from the creators, whether it's Toei with the anime or Naoko with the manga, going and adding stuff in later stories (like the Star Seeds concept wasn't there in the first series) that contradicts the earlier stuff.
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Post by bioengineer » Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:20 am

Rainbow wrote: As for it being Usagi's Star Seed, I'm not sure about that, mainly because if Senshi can't survive without their Star Seeds, how come Usagi and even Sailor Moon could exist before the Silver Crystal was formed?
Senshi can't survive without star seeds? Then how do you explain Galaxia?

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Post by Starscream » Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:11 am

jupiter23 wrote:...since we don't see the Silver Crystal between Sailor Moon R and Sailor Stars...
I believe the Silver Crystal appears in the first episode of Sailor Moon S, when the daimon attacks Sailor Moon. She bites at her brooch and leaves a copy of her face attached to it; we see the brooch crack, and the crystal is shown to lose its luster. The next episode Usagi and Mamoru are able to transform it into a heart-shaped crystal.
bioengineer wrote:Senshi can't survive without star seeds? Then how do you explain Galaxia?
Chaos is keeping her body together? I mean, all the other senshi get wiped out when Galaxia takes their Star Seeds, and the only reason Uranus, Neptune, and the Animamates are still around is because of the bracelets.
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Post by Sailormars Obsessed fan » Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:16 am

we see the Silver Crystal every time Usagi transforms but its partially covered by the brooch of the season so we cants tell if its a flower or diamond shape.
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Post by Starry Eyes » Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:55 pm

and it doesn't quite make sense that the silver crystal is her star seed. Before she had the crystal she was living.. and if u watch whenever a star seed is taken someone dies... why doesn't Usagi die? Is this just a manga plot hole?
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Post by Jeff » Wed Mar 21, 2007 7:23 pm

The Silver Crystal and Usagi's star seed are the same thing. The name of the episode in which her star seed is nearly taken is something like "The Stolen Silver Crystal."

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Post by Tiff » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:02 pm

Jeff wrote:The Silver Crystal and Usagi's star seed are the same thing. The name of the episode in which her star seed is nearly taken is something like "The Stolen Silver Crystal."
Correct.

In fact, in the manga, the senshi's starseeds are referred to as "Sailor Crystals"...they are born in the galaxy cauldron and are given power for that planet's senshi. Usagi's is no exception. Her star seed IS her ginzuishou. She cannot live without either one.
and it doesn't quite make sense that the silver crystal is her star seed. Before she had the crystal she was living.. and if u watch whenever a star seed is taken someone dies... why doesn't Usagi die? Is this just a manga plot hole?
Um...Usagi DOES "die". She gets sent to the galaxy cauldron, just like everybody else who dies. The Guardian of the cauldron, Guardian Cosmos, lets people decide if they want to receive a new life, or remain in the cauldron as purest, truest star seeds. Usagi chose to live her new life, and she wakes up in the future, marries Mamoru, and etc.

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Post by Starry Eyes » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:01 pm

oh ok.. well i haven't read the manga so I never knew that. But what about before she even had the silver crystal. In the first arc, the silver crystal was split into 7 rainbow crystals and inside the 7 monsters.. how was usagi technically alive then? The silver crystal wasn't formed at that point.
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Post by Tiff » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:20 pm

Starry Eyes wrote:oh ok.. well i haven't read the manga so I never knew that. But what about before she even had the silver crystal. In the first arc, the silver crystal was split into 7 rainbow crystals and inside the 7 monsters.. how was usagi technically alive then? The silver crystal wasn't formed at that point.
first off, yes, it was, technically. How do you think Queen Serenity saved her daughter and the senshi? She used the ginzuishou/silver crystal.

As for the "split into 7 crystals" thing...no, not really. They were sealed into SHARDS of the silver crystal. The silver wasn't "split" into 7 crystals itself...just made from shards from the crystal. The crystal was re-formed by Usagi's tear when she became Princess Serenity, and the rainbow crystals flew back into the silver crystal becuase they were a PART of it.

By the way, you could look a lot of this up yourself, so please get back on topic and try to use google for this sort of thing.

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Rachel: Huh...a...moo point?
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Post by Starry Eyes » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:51 pm

jeeeez sorry. i thought we were all just discussing different points.. all i was doing was bringing up a point.
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Post by Tiff » Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:58 pm

Starry Eyes wrote:jeeeez sorry. i thought we were all just discussing different points.. all i was doing was bringing up a point.
ADMIN MODE:

Don't get snippy with mods and admins. I wasn't in any way rude to you. I answered your questions, ASKED you to please get back on topic, and to try and use a search engine for such common questions. We're discussing what we didn't like about Sailor Stars, not asking questions over and over about star seeds/crystals/general sailor moon stuff.

It is a forum rule to use search engines for such general questions. Read the rules once more if you're confused, please.

Joey: The question is, Rachel, does he like you? ''Cuz if he doesn''t, then it''s all just a moo point.
Rachel: Huh...a...moo point?
Joey: Yeah. It''''s like a cow''s opinion. It doesn''t matter....It''s moo.
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Post by Starscream » Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:02 am

Well, her points, I believe, were germane to the topic at hand; we were discussing Star Seeds and the Ginzuishou, and she brought up a valid point that even I have had confusion about in the past. The show itself never explicitly states that the Rainbow Crystals were just pieces of the Ginzuishou, while the "core" or "essence" of it was within Usagi the whole time, and lots of sites out there are vague or give conflicting information about whether or not the Rainbow Crystals are mere shards or the primary components of the Ginzuishou.

Further, even if the Ginzuishou did exist before it was completely reformed...how does Usagi exist all those times when the Ginzuishou is not in Usagi's hands? If removal of the Sailor Crystal destroys the Sailor Senshi, then she should have been dead all those times whenever she let go of the Wand, or when she was separated from her brooch, etc. The issue about Sailor Crystal = Ginzuishou really can be confusing when Usagi can lose her Sailor Crystal at the drop of a hat.
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